Leadership Espresso with Stefan Götz
In a world of constant change and complexity, true leadership isn’t about control— it’s about curiosity, clarity, and courage. Join Executive Coach Stefan Götz - www.stefan-goetz.com, as he helps accomplished leaders unlock their authentic leadership compass, inspire peak team performance, and achieve sustainable success—without sacrificing life beyond work. Whether you’re a seasoned executive or an emerging leader, this podcast will equip you with the mindset, strategies, and tools to lead with confidence, purpose, and impact.
Leadership Espresso with Stefan Götz
Fast, Pragmatic, Engaged: Leadership Lessons from China's Automotive Industry feat. Kierysch COO Montaplast China
The automotive industry stands at a critical crossroads, facing what Sebastian Kierysch calls "the biggest challenge we have had in the complete industry since its beginning." After 15+ years as a German executive in China, Sebastian offers rare insights into navigating this turbulent landscape where traditional manufacturers confront nimble Chinese competitors in a "bloody red ocean" of fierce competition.
Drawing from his experience managing five manufacturing plants in China, Sebastian reveals the stark contrasts between German precision and Chinese pragmatism. While German companies typically seek comprehensive information before acting, their Chinese counterparts move decisively with just 70-80% clarity. This difference in approach partly explains how BYD has risen to become the sixth-largest global car manufacturer, slashing development cycles from 36 to as little as 12 months.
Sebastian challenges conventional wisdom about cross-cultural leadership, sharing how he works 100+ hour weeks during crises, speaks Mandarin to better connect with his 1,700 employees, and hosts "lunch with leaders" where staff can speak directly with senior management. His approach creates psychological safety where innovation thrives despite uncertainty.
The conversation explores fascinating cultural dynamics, revealing how the middle generation of Chinese workers (born around 1985) uniquely blends traditional values with international mindset. Sebastian explains why challenging the status quo remains essential even when current methods have proven successful: "Who tells you that you did the best? Who says there is no other solution?"
For leaders navigating today's complex global landscape, Sebastian's closing wisdom resonates powerfully: "It's about being bold enough to make a decision, because if you make a decision, you make maybe a mistake, but if you don't make a decision, you already did the mistake." Listen now for insights that will transform how you approach leadership during times of profound change.
Listen to the Leadership Espresso Podcast:
https://open.spotify.com/show/4OT3BYzDHMafETOMgFEor3
View the Leadership Espresso Podcast:
https://www.youtube.com/@Stefangoetz_Global_Leadership/videos
Connect with Stefan Götz on LinkedIn:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/stefangoetz/
Check out Stefan's Executive and Team Coaching
https://www.stefan-goetz.com/
Welcome Sebastian Schierisch, a senior executive, as a German working in China for over 15 years. Thank you, sebastian, for being part of the show for today.
Speaker 2:Hey, Stefan, hi Nice to have you also here in China on my screen and welcome to the International Mindset.
Speaker 1:Podcast for today, I would like to say yeah, absolutely, and this is our topic. What can we learn from China in these days in the automotive market? And you have been dealt with so many issues in that country. You faced so many topics and and you came out always one level above, above, above, so let's talk about? What is the? The biggest event, the biggest issue you ever had, and how did you turn it from uncertainty into an opportunity?
Speaker 2:Yes, Stefan, I think this is exactly the right word the uncertainty. Because, as you know, the automotive market, not only in China, but also in Germany and the world, is at the moment on the edge of survive or die. So this is basically what you heard about China. It's true, it's a bloody red ocean here and it's only going over price reductions to sell your cars. So we, as a or me let me say about me, me as a OEM before 24 years in the OEM side, and then I moved the past seven years to the tier one side of the business I have to say the uncertainty at these times now is probably the most big challenge we had in the complete industry since beginning of the industry. We know the Lehman Brothers crisis in 2008-2009, then the automotive crisis in 2015,.
Speaker 2:Covid-19 in 1921. So a lot of crisis, but nothing is compared to this crisis now. So, out of my experience with the most difficult situations we are facing, experience with the most difficult situations we are facing so we had major injuries or major incident in one of our plants here in China I have five plants. One big incident happens that stopped our production completely, but we never stopped the customer also only one minute. So we continuously delivered to our customers, Okay.
Speaker 1:We are in this uncertain, complex environment. It's automotive. It's brutal right now. Yeah, probably the industry that has to transform the most in any industry right now. So what was your approach? As being like, born german, but with an internet mindset, and, and, and living in china for 16 years, can you describe in detail so we understand? There is maybe an opportunity.
Speaker 2:Yes, so, like you said, many people think this is very risky and very dangerous and the situation is not to handle.
Speaker 2:Many people get confused or even fear, anxious about that. But I see it from another point of view because, as you as a coach knows that sometimes it helps to step back from your own position to see the current situation from another point of view. So I see also opportunities inside the current situation we are in. So, but how we do it, we are, you can, you can name it restructuring, probably right. So I come into the company with a very low performing operations uh, cultural differences between german is a german company and chinese employees and leadership. Um, there was more or less a chaos as well, if you can describe it like that, and there was also the global clarification and certifications not in place. So how we did it and it was very easy from from now to see backwards, but at that moment is difficult. So we put lean systems in place.
Speaker 2:Legacy habits um, we, or I tried to give my team clarity even in the chaos situation sometimes, and this is maybe what we german are very proud of and very good, and we need to make it exactly right. It must be like this we need to follow the process five minutes earlier in the meeting and everything must be point, point, point. But sorry, this is not what we need in this, in this kind of situation we are in at the moment. We need, even though we have only maybe 80 percent, only 70 percent of clarity. We need to make decisions.
Speaker 2:So we do it, we do the decisions and comment or I communicate my decision to my people, to my team for sure I have some casualties on the way means some people don't accept, so okay, I let them free. But then new people come right, so and and go the way with us. So, very good, and this is the topic of why I'm here, why we are here. We have a bigger vision. We want to have trust and also the transparency from top to down, or not only top down by execution. You need to do that fully agree.
Speaker 1:Now let's go more in detail about the vision and the way you communicate in a Chinese environment.
Speaker 2:Well, stefan, this is basically. I think everybody can learn that, but you have to have an open mind. So how I did was, first of all, if you don't speak the language, you will have a problem to approach the people. So I'm not fluent in chinese, by far not, but it's enough to communicate. And if the people so the chinese colleagues and in my company we have 1700 people, five foreigners, including three, two top management and two directors and one on one expert, so that's all so, and we have to bring german product, quality, german mindset, uh, into this community and make a fusion out of it.
Speaker 2:And you need the entrance point and this is the language. So if you try to speak, with your limited language skills, the mother tongue of the people you are dealing with and I would like to exclude china now I would like to say it's the complete world, it's everywhere. If you're in india, if in thailand, if you are in america, okay, for us more easy because it's english, right. But if you go to roman or something like this, if you try to learn their mother language, then you can also approach these people better. And for the vision it's about be clear what is the company standing for? What are you standing for? As a leader? I would like to say I'm a leader. I'm not the manager For sure. I'm not the manager for sure. I'm sometimes the manager because I need to make the decision, but I am more a coaching approached leader. So I try to generate color.
Speaker 1:Yeah yeah, our stereotype about chinese is from the past. You know, it's like you have to tell them everything and then they are like robots and do what? No, I don't think that's true any longer. So what is the mindset you have to deal with, and how can you kind of combine the German mindset with the Chinese mindset?
Speaker 2:So you said the very interesting point, the stereotype of the Chinese people. Right, and the Chinese has the stereotype of the Germans for sure. So there's Weisswurst and Lederhosen, yes, so this is the typical German stereotype for Chinese people. So as it's not true for every German, for some it's still valid. So also the Chinese top-down approach. So they are very hierarchy hearing. It's still in place for some people, but there are also some individuals that are not in this way.
Speaker 2:So, for example, I have great leaders in my team who really worked with German companies over a decade or two decades already. So they decide to come to Monta because they would like to come to us to work with me together as their leader. They are not coming because of our name. They are not coming because we have a good product. They are coming because they feel treasured and they can develop their own mindset. So and for this you need the vision on how your way looks like, the why- is.
Speaker 2:Is that the young generation of the Chinese, or is it even true for the older generation, opening for that approach, for being treasured and yeah this is a very tricky question, because it's not the young and not the old, it's the middle generation, it's the, the generation that are born, let me say, around 1985 yes this.
Speaker 2:This generation is still in this Mao Chairman, mao's mindset, but with the opening of China and then the blooming in the 90s and early 2000s, they have the international mindset. So they are the people who are the broader mind. The old generation they are hierarchy and the younger generation, they are hierarchy and the younger generation. Nowadays they are also. If I go to the shop floor and there's just a 21, 22-year-old student, start work. They're both in front of you. I say hey, hey, hey, come on, I'm the boss here, but you don't need to do that. So it's interesting to see. Very good question, by the way.
Speaker 1:Now, what are the three core factors of the Chinese workplace? What is the approach that we believe it's pragmatic and it's fast and it's pragmatic and it's fast and it's a growth mindset. But what do you think? What are those three core elements that we could now focus on to explore more in depth?
Speaker 2:First of all, the most important thing for sure is the salary. I mean, this is clear, this is why we also go to work. But also the same amount of level is the sounds stupid, but it's the food. So in Chinese companies in China, you usually offer free meals for the people. So they get lunch, they get breakfast, they get dinner, maybe a midnight snack, depending on when they are working.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:So and then they are very in Germany we say fleißig they are very engaged in this, what they are doing. So you will seldom find someone who stops nine to five, and this is what you know in europe from all this newspaper it's 996 yeah, this nine hours from nine to nine and then 12 hours from nine to nine and then six days, sometimes it's even in seven days. And from my own experience when we had this incident of one of our plans in late or early august last year until early october, so probably four months I worked 100 hours a week plus one sleep, only two hours a week one.
Speaker 1:Sleep only two hours a week. Yeah, because that's kind of a commitment that's crazy.
Speaker 2:Yes, but this is also what my people are doing. You know this is I. I am a role master, for for them, they are the role model. So if the boss is staying in the company and work with them hand in hand to solve the problems, they are also even more engaged. And this is probably also from this hierarchy's thinking. Some people not leave before you leave.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that reminds me of the early days of the now crazy guy from california, when he launched three and he was in production hell, he slept on the shop floor for three hours every day.
Speaker 2:So it's yes, so this was the first two weeks after the incident that happens, yes, and actually my wife come to visit me and not I go back home to visit her. So I mean, this is also a commitment of the family. And this is the third point I would like to mention to regard to your question. The family is also very important, even though the young chinese people they don't have family right, so they are earning the money to build a family. But the people like I mentioned this 80, 85 born ages they are, they have a family and everything like this, and very seldom the family give them stress if they work overtime or something like this okay, I understand.
Speaker 1:Now. It's like, um, it's almost like, if you understand well the environment you're in, you adapt that environment, you know. So they don't have to change culturally. You know, they feel, they feel welcome, they feel well and they feel yes, like you say, which is which great, yes, understand, yeah, just under. Then, yeah, you're not in germany, you're in china. I, I think that's obvious. Now, how come that in the automotive industry in china now, by the way, by way, byd is now listed number six on the world ranking as a car manufacturer, so not far behind Toyota and Volkswagen anymore. But how come that they are able to have development cycles down from 36 to 24 and even maybe 12 months? Down from 36 to 24 and even maybe 12 months? How can they? I think you described, while we built one airport in Berlin, they built 80. What makes them fast, pragmatic, engaged and execution strong? What is it?
Speaker 2:Yes, so out of my work experience with the Chinese OEMs here but, by the way, now Volkswagen, bmw and Mercedes-Benz Daimler truck is also in China they changed their mindset from this traditional german kind of stuff building around the car to try to, to merge to the and you know the ev is very strong in china to the ev things. Well, when in china they are building the vehicle around the system, I mean they have the platform and then they're building around. So you mentioned BYD, right? Yes, so if you sit in the BYD, it's like you sit in the VW. If you sit in Golf or you sit in the Passat or you sit in the Touareg, everything is in the right, in the same place, the buttons, okay, sometimes a little bit wider, a little bit taller, depending on the interior you buy, or you have different displays or whatever. But actually you know, okay, I'm an fw, so they are doing the same stuff, but they're building around the system.
Speaker 2:You mentioned also the airport. So it's all about scale, the, the. The matter is scale in china, so in germ, if we buy two airports, they are looking completely different, because two completely different global general contractor will build this kind of stuff, right, two design institutes will make the fancy stuff In China. It's basically more or less all the same and only the cover is different. So it means they can scale very easy. Sometimes in China it takes a long time to make a decision this is similar to us but if it's made, then it's executed in light speed. This is what you see on these fancy TikTok videos when they build a bridge over a weekend right Beijing or where it was. We talked about COVID before. So the hospitals, yeah. So over seven days they built a 1,000-bed hospital.
Speaker 1:So I mean, let's be honest, even if BMW, mercedes, audi now changes its brand and try to become like Chinese, we can never become like Chinese because our cost of manufacturing a car is just so much higher. Yes, now when they turn, you know, when they design a car based on a software and put some wheels around and are fast executors and scale. This is typically what you think about americans so so what is our opportunity in germany?
Speaker 1:uh, and I'm saying, you know we have the, probably we have the brightest minds on engineering. Still I'm sure. Yes, still still, yes, but it looks like that we need a slightly different mindset, a different approach. Yes, and the one that is becoming Chinese, but what is your experience? What was it? Is it the combination? What is? What do we need to learn from them? No, your experience, no. What was it? Is it the combination? What do we need to learn from them? And how do we, yes, to really leverage our strength?
Speaker 2:Yes, so the thing is, I was pleased and very, very honored to meet Rudolf Scharping like five, six weeks ago here in Shanghai, and we had a meeting with him.
Speaker 2:He's on the road, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, he's a consulting company. He's around and we have the same topic. We have the same topic. So how we can make Germany or the German products or the German companies great again sounds very fashion, because this guy with the fancy hairstyle there from America say the same thing about his country. But he said, and this is really and I think this hits the nail on the head in Germany we have the great mind and the still the best ground engineering and scientists for a lot of things, from automotive, medicine, everything absolutely true, but the execution is the problem. And he said and I now I quote him less talking, more doing so. This is what we are doing in china here. So we are eager and, like I said in the beginning, if we only know 50-60% of the of the whole picture, but it's necessary to make a decision because, out of urgency, because we cannot wait, we do a decision instead of wait maybe four, five, six hours or one day to get to 80-90% yeah, highly interesting.
Speaker 1:Now I figure myself being in your team. You know we hear an environment, uncertain environment we have a lot of pressure on cost or development times.
Speaker 1:And now I'm used as a german engineer. I'm used to cc my boss and his boss and get a response, or if I can do this or whatever. I'm sorry for stereotyping, maybe different in times. I heard about this in some companies in Germany. So how can they dare to be more entrepreneurial? Is it in their gene, is it the mindset, or is it an allowance or an empowerment from leadership?
Speaker 2:Well, this is first of all for the small decisions. This is empowerment for the daily running the business to ensure the production. For the big topics like this incident right, there's no way around this need to go to us, to the sea level, otherwise the complete company is on risk. So you, you need to find in china the right people for the right job. This is first and most important. And then you need to empower them. But these 100 plus hours per week is not coming because they cannot make a decision right, or I don't empower them Absolutely.
Speaker 1:I mean Sebastian, but these are the same concepts senior executives know in Germany. So why is there still a difference in execution, or in speed, or in being pragmatic? What does it need to adapt?
Speaker 2:For us Germans yeah.
Speaker 1:In general. No, I mean, we are in the European environment here. Yeah, I'm a German. Yes, of course.
Speaker 2:Let me phrase a question to you. Are you getting nervous, angry if your counterpart is 10, 15 minutes late to a meeting?
Speaker 1:Probably 10, 15 minutes late to a meeting, probably.
Speaker 2:At least I'm questioning what happened.
Speaker 2:But there was a sense of irritation in the room. So do I 15 years ago or 16 years ago, now, I don't really care, because I know they will come. I know they have something to do and if they not come I will call them and then they will come or they say okay. So it's a kind of also a flexibility from our side, and this is the building the bridges between the two cultures, because this is very, very different. Yeah, so if I say I will come soon means in china completely different thing, like in german, for example.
Speaker 2:Right, so we can we can put the time behind it, but here it's different. But back to the question of of the, for the, for the, for the german oems. Right, they should not change the, the, let me say the spine, the ground where they're coming from. Because if you drive a BYD or if you drive an Audi even though the price Audi is also under high pressure, so they need to reduce the prices here but if you drive these cars you feel obviously different, right so? But is this the question for the young generation who are buying now a car? No, for them is, in the connection, the connectivity. The most important thing it's not so much the experience of driving from the road feeling, from the noises of the vehicle, it's more the connectivity.
Speaker 1:I mean, if I put myself into the position of BMW, for instance, I have the brightest engineers on this planet. I know how to build a car. We have a fantastic product but we can sell it at the price we still sell in Europe. Now, would working more hours, do I mean? The solution seems like, yeah, we have to become faster at less cost and turn more towards the interconnectivity of cars and build and create values and services around this. I mean, in the last part, we could probably, you know, achieve, but I don't see. I don't see from, or maybe from your experience. You know you are under that pressure. You know your head board in germany is under tremendous pressure. You have to deliver in china to OEMs that come from Europe or Germany. Where does it lead towards?
Speaker 2:Where can you see, from your experience, a way forward? If we talk about BMW, vw, audi, mercedes, the traditional OEMs, they had great times in China. So why? Because they are premium for the Chinese. So the people who have money at 10 years ago, they buy this kind of brands as more expensive as better. But who bought?
Speaker 2:BYD at that time was the farmer from the countryside that don't have so much money, and this was also the quality level. So BYD learned a lot, a lot, and you can see this on the vehicles and you can see on YouTube a lot of videos about the tests. So they did a great job partially. So what is for the German OEMs maybe most important is stop this over engineering, because a lot of things that is inside the vehicle nobody needs. For example, I mean automatic speed control yes, okay, it's nearly all cars in China, but I very seldom see someone who use it. Air conditioning will be turned off and open the window. I mean, air conditioning is very important, don't take it away. But Spaltmaße, so the distance between the two parts on the car, it's not really matter if you have a 3 millimeter or 2.5 millimeter, nobody really cares in China for that.
Speaker 2:But these are all these kind of hidden costs. That increases the prices. Plus I talk now about my OEM experience overestimated and over also kind of engineered test cycles. Who needs 150,000 kilometer test in China when most of the people never will drive their car for 50,000 kilometers, right? So I mean yes, then this is also the difference to Tesla and to the other BYDs and NIOs and is also very famous in Europe. They do not really care too much for this long-term road tests. By the way, nio is more like Audi, so they are on the higher price end and you feel it directly on the vehicle when BYD is still the low cost one. And, as we discussed before, they are also running now into trouble because they have a reduction in their volumes at the moment to face. So they stopped one shift in several plants and they stopped the investment into the future. So also the reality is coming to them now.
Speaker 1:Absolutely Now to kind of start finishing our podcast. What are the three key questions about leadership we should executives everywhere, but particularly also in Europe with business in China. What are the three core questions now they need to ask to thrive in uncertainty in this environment.
Speaker 2:I would like to turn it from a question to messages, if you allow, to messages, if you allow. So I would like to say, because I think you can ask questions, but this is the coaching approach. I would like to be more advisory now for the people who are listening and interested in these topics. Yeah, you're an expert, you can advise. You should challenge the status quo, because this is what I do every day. Is this what we are doing today? Right and not stick for sure you have a plan somehow, but is the plan valid? So challenge every day the status quo, and this relentlessly about the circumstances and this relentlessly about the circumstances.
Speaker 1:Now may I just jump right into because, challenging the status quo. I probably need more detail because my experience they have controlling everywhere, they have KPIs everywhere, so they are over control. I believe so. They are over control, I believe so. They probably think we challenge ourselves every day, every single day, on cost, on quality, on delivery. So what does this guy mean?
Speaker 2:What part needs to be challenged? Well, we Germans say and this was my experience when I go back to germany, uh, several years ago, for a very short period, the people say to me why I should change. I do this 15 years and I, I was very successful and I'm still am. So then I ask one very simple question and most of the people cannot answer. And this was yes, you did 15 years, great. But who tells you that you did the best, who say that there is no other solution to the problem? Why you think you should not change what you are doing for the past 15 years? Maybe it was not 100% correct.
Speaker 1:So, okay, I see two elements. One is focusing on could have done better, which is the past focus, but the second element is more to bring me up to be the better and the best version in the next 15 years. So this is challenging the mindset. It's not about I've done this. We've done this, we were successful. We were successful. Some of my clients, a chairman, once said, stefan, the biggest trap is success because you get fat. Exactly, people say, yeah, I'll just do what you want. Jeff Bezos calls it in Amazon always have a first day approach, day one approach. Yeah, be always like kind of new. So it's like uh, what I hear is like, uh, be willing to learn, be willing to check if what you're doing is is still relevant in the new setting.
Speaker 2:Yes, exactly.
Speaker 2:And also if we come back to this mindset change, I think in this I mean you can change a program in the machine, you can change the design of the part, you can even change how you build a car right the system around the car or into the car or the car around the system but what the biggest challenge is really the mindset change, and I said this to my board nearly one year ago. I tell them we are focusing on mindset change and this mindset change is not a 100-meter sprint, it's more a triple Ironman.
Speaker 2:Absolutely, and I think this is very, very on point here.
Speaker 1:I think you know this is the core issue now how can we transform? And now, from your experience being in that environment, how do you lead in these transformational times? How can you help people?
Speaker 2:Because once you ask them can you do.
Speaker 1:you know you have to mirror yourself, your approach to what if it's going to be relevant in five or 10 or 15 years and most people I know they step out of the comfort zone, they start learning, sometimes the anxiety zone, so they get anxious a little bit. So what is your approach about helping build a good environment for people to want to change? Maybe?
Speaker 2:build a good environment for people to want to change? Maybe, yes, so, first of all, we all face this kind of uncertainties, um, and also for sure I'm I'm a human right. I'm also facing anxious about situations of fear, of stress. But if, if I try to bring out clarity in this moment that is really focusing on this issue at this moment, and I translate this to the language to the people who are involved. They maybe don't see the whole picture, but I bring the clarity for their field of this, what they have to do, and offering my help. So I never feel stressed out, I never feel burned out. By the way, burnout in China is not available by default.
Speaker 2:So first of all, create clarity that they can work.
Speaker 1:What kind of clarity? Can you be more precise? Like, give an example, okay.
Speaker 2:Okay, we are now, like you mentioned, in the restructuring phase, so I get one project management office position for this to control and lead the project over the next three years, and we research inside our company. But they all are busy, as you can imagine.
Speaker 2:Because I just bring up a complete new team there, combined from old and new peoples, yeah, um, so they are busy with their sense themselves at the moment. So I decide I will get a fresh master student, just graduate two weeks ago, for this position, and she is a woman. She says I don't know if I can do that. I say no worries, I believe from your CV, from your experience on university and also some job experience already, you can do that. These are the steps. I will guide you. I will stay next to you. Then she asked me why you are not doing this by yourself.
Speaker 2:Good question, because my time is also limited, right, but my time is limited. I need to look for strategy topics. I have five plans right.
Speaker 2:I need to really balance my time that is also like yours 24 hours a day. So to show her okay, okay, this is the way to create the templates talk with the consulting company to make very clear what we expect and also make very clear to here to her. You can call 24 7. If you have a problem, I am here, I'm the steering committee, I will help you to make it. And if somebody is not performing, because as a project manager, for sure you don't have power, you are the tiger without teeth. So this means you need to, you need to motivate the people, do something, and for sure you can borrow my power. But this should be the last step. But you can ask me as your coach, and so this I do with all my people on the shop floor.
Speaker 1:So they are free to go straight to you to ask for help.
Speaker 2:Yes, everyone, even the cleaning staff or the worker on the shop floor.
Speaker 1:So if you are talking about, leadership, because leadership is preso.
Speaker 2:When we started last year July, no May I started in May oh God time flies I established a so-called lunch with the leaders. So in this lunch, when I visit all the plants, the supervisor, engineer level and also some employee who are willing, are invited to have lunch with me and my leadership team. So my other two C-level I mean not their manager.
Speaker 2:They are excluded. So the management of the plant is excluded from this lunch. So I take one hour. Whoa, you know where it goes, right? Yeah, so I take one hour only for them to have a lunch with them, and we are not taking the canteen food we are ordering from outside. Sometimes it's pizza, sometimes it's Korean rice spaghetti.
Speaker 1:I think they can deliver that lunch like five, ten, depending on this.
Speaker 2:it depends on the size of the plant, right? So let's say, in average it's about 10 to 20 people, and how do they and then we sit together.
Speaker 1:Yeah, how do they use this format? Are they approaching you to say hi Sebastian, I have a problem here and there, can you help? Or how does it work?
Speaker 2:And you see, now the circle is closing slowly, because in the beginning you asked me oh, in the middle is three major topics in China for the environment, and this is food. So for sure, in the first one, two times when we started in each plant, it was a little bit shaky because, oh, the big boss come now and have lunch with me and I need to talk with him.
Speaker 2:I cannot speak english right yes so, um, but this was very interesting to see because then I start in my chinese to talk with them and then somebody speak up. I can translate, may I boss, I say, oh for sure, let's help, let's work together. Right, to be approachable, and the first two, two times was not much communication for sure. Environmental topics yeah, the food can be better, the toilet cleaners could be better, so basically what you have if you have a big plant of four or five hundred people. But interesting is you see the change. And now they are actually waiting for this lunch with leaders, so, and they even come up two times. So before I go to my, my, my, my majority leave, um, they come up and say, sebastian, I would like to have a different food, because every time the same. I say I think I don't recognize it. Thank you very much. Let's, let's order some different things. Yeah, so we make a small questionnaire what you like?
Speaker 1:okay pizza.
Speaker 2:Okay, we want a lot of Italian food and lot of was there? Well, some, some, some spaghetti, and you know. And then we have a very good conversation by lunch, but not very official with agenda. Now maintenance, yeah, yeah, and sometimes you need to, sometimes you need to talk first. I use this also as a kind of a mini town hall meeting to inform them what's happening in the company, what's happening in our other facility that is 2000 kilometers far away, maybe Right, so I also utilize this kind of events to share them what's happening in one I don't want to say my company in our company.
Speaker 2:And so Sebastian, yes, I don't want to in our company, and Sebastian, yes, I think.
Speaker 1:Tell me if I'm wrong, but to finish and to close, and what I learned from our conversation it is not that much about the overall strategy, maybe about the differences and commonalities of germans and chinese, but I learned from your approach, from your experience being in both markets, in both cultures, being there for 16 or even more years it's you can put your heart to the products, but you can also put your heart to the people, and that's maybe a common language everybody understands and it feels like you are creating a safe place where people want to belong, want to add whatever their strength is, and it's more a question about mindset, it's more a question about leadership, it's more, you know, releasing all the potential from that people.
Speaker 1:And this is, to me, the essence that I get from our conversation, which gives me kind of not hope, but which gives me an opening, a gateway to come up with great solutions in leadership that will help everybody bring out his best and enjoy it. That's even better If you're working 50 or more hours. You at least what you want. You want to enjoy this and not feel threatened or whatever. So, yes, anything to add from your side that is not yet put into the right light or focus.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so you said it very, very correct what's a company? And this is also one of the workshops I hold with my teams, because I'm also giving workshops and some mentorings to the people what is a company? Is the building the company, the machines or the products? And it's very surprisingly, very few people say no, actually the people is the company.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:So, and I think this should be, this should be the the, the thing, and the future does not belong to the guys who make everything cautiously and very accurate over engineering, but also, and I think almost and I mean you mentioned this crazy guy in America who sleep on the floor. I think he did it just weeks ago again, right, probably. I think he did it just weeks ago again, right, probably. It's about to be bold enough to make a decision and go ahead, because if you make a decision, you make maybe a mistake, but if you don't make a decision.
Speaker 1:You already did the mistake. Fantastic conversations, lots of insights. I'd like to carry this one on, maybe in a year's time to find out what's more to learn about it.
Speaker 2:For the time being, thank you, sebastian for being on the show and wishing you all good travels, safe travels in your ventures. Thank you, stefan. Yes, and hopefully we can meet us very soon in Munich or somewhere around absolutely anytime, 24 7 okay let's see what's my schedule telling us okay, bye.